Can we all just get along.

So I saw a post on the blog, Is there a God titled, why does it have to be a war?  And my initial reaction to this post was one of agreement that it doesn’t have to be a war or a war of words.  However that opinion of mine is starting to change.

I sit in church almost every Sunday and occasionally do a mid-week bible study with the wife, and I can now understand why some atheist Hate religion and especially the Church. Because out of one side of their mouth they will say I love you to your face, but out of the other side of their mouth in the pulpit; the unbeliever will be spoken about as something disgusting that needs to be cleansed. That doubt and unbelief is a sin and of the worst kinds of sin.  And yes that is something that I have heard on a Sunday morning.

At times it feels like my position on the existence of God is spoken of so negatively that one would think I am their enemy. But when its all over, its hugs and smiles.

It’s almost like that mentality. You are either with us or against us. And I can see it on both sides. Its hard to come to a common ground when the bible itself says that it would prefer you either hot or cold.  And that the bible says that there is only one thong worst than an atheist.  (I Timothy 5:8)  But all others rapists, terrorist, child molesters are much preferable company than an atheist.  The Bible even equates the unbelieving atheist to lawlessness, wickedness, and darkness.  (II Corinthians 6:14-15)  It even goes so far as to say a Christian should not even eat with someone who has rejected the gospel.  And let’s not forget the all to infamous Old Testament scripture where it implies to kill those who don’t hold to the same faith.

All one needs to do is read the old testament to see how mad God got when his people the Israelites compromised their faith and beliefs.  And let’s be honest with ourselves, religion at its fundamental core is uncompromising and unwavering.  Not just in christianity, but in all the Abrahamic religions.  As the bible says, the I am the way, “The truth, and the light. No one can come to the father except through me.”  And how can anyone compromise or even befriend that mentality.

In all fairness, atheist are not completely innocent either in that some feel (mostly just the new atheist movement) that it is okay to mock and ridicule the Christian.  That the entire institute of religion is a handicap upon our world. At first I thought this was a very radical standpoint, but not so much anymore. As Christopher Hitchens persuades; religion is a plague upon our societies unlike no other.  That in the general thinking of these two mind sets; atheism and Christianity. We can’t both be right. One of us has to be wrong.

As Sam Harris says in his letter to a Christian nation, that we should “...be honest with ourselves: in the fullness of time, one side is really going to win this argument, and the other side is really going to lose.

As I am only one man giving my opinion. I’ve never had a personally bad experience with religion until I was on the outside of religion. Yet in my short experience there is no compromise and yes it is a war ( of words).  And it appears to me that its the (radical) religious that declared it.

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About M. Rodriguez

When I first received Christ salvation, I made it a priority to read the whole bible and I did. But it was the Bible that made me question my faith. For I found it flawed and lacking. Due to this I launched a personal inquiry/investigation into my faith, and ultimately realized that the Christian God of the Bible was indeed man-made. Now I Blog about those findings and life after Christ.
This entry was posted in atheism, atheist, atheist vs christian, bible, character, christian faith, christopher hitchens, church, creationism, debate, emotions, evolution, evolution vs. creation, Free-Thought, freethinker, laws of logic, quote, religion, religion vs. science, sam harris, scripture, scripture alone, unbelief and tagged , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink.

7 Responses to Can we all just get along.

  1. unkleE says:

    Hi Marcus, thanks for this thoughtful and honest assessment. As the person who wrote the post you started with, let me offer a few comments.

    1. I think it is regrettable that christians are sometimes less than loving towards non-believers. All in-groups tend to do this, but christians of all people ought to be different because it is part of our faith that we should be different.

    2. I think you have to take account of the context. Most christians believe we are “sinners”, i.e. we fall short of the standard God expects for us. Some emphasise this more than others. Those who strongly emphasise it believe we are ALL ” something disgusting that needs to be cleansed” – they believe it about themselves as much as about you. Now I think they overstate this and dwell on it too much, but in fairness you shouldn’t (I think) think they are singling out atheists.

    3. I think you misrepresent 1 Tim 5:8. It says: “Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.” It isn’t saying anything about unbelievers, it is saying that the person who won’t look after their family is not behaving like a believer, and so has two counts against them.

    4. You should be able to appreciate the wisdom of 2 Cor 6:14-15. We christians believe that a relationship of forgiveness and grace with God is the most important thing in life, so anything we have in common with someone must be less important than this. Not only does a believer-unbeliever marriage make one or both partners have to compromise on things of integrity and deep importance, but it takes away one of the most important aspects of christian marriage. I believe life is a constant spiritual “battle”, and my wife and I pray every morning on that basis. If we couldn’t pray with each other, we would feel vulnerable and less connected to God. It’s that important. I understand this is a delicate subject for you, and I respect the things you have written about it, but therefore you of all people should understand why Paul gives this teaching.

    5. But Paul doesn’t say believers shouldn’t eat with unbelievers (as far as I know). On the contrary, he says quite specifically that we shouldn’t behave like that (1 Cor 5:9-11). His comments relate to someone who claims to be a believer but is giving the fellowship a bad name by flagrantly immoral behaviour. This is a quite different thing.

    I believe Sam Harris is right, only one side will win, can win. But the New Testament doesn’t allow that to be a reason to be nasty to non-believers. We live in a pluralist society, and we all need to get along. Paul says quite clearly (Romans 12:18): “as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone” That is how I and most christians I know try to live.

    Thanks for the opportunity to present another viewpoint. Best wishes.

    • M. Rodriguez says:

      hi again unk,

      I think for me being on the other side of the fence is just something I’m not use to. I remember reading a book a while back by Christian Researcher George Barna, called unchristian. And it was dealing with why some people reject christianity from the perspective of those who are none believers. I really enjoyed the book it was well researched and written. And in his research he found that there were many things that discouraged one from being a christian (i.e.- christian were too political, anti-homophobic, always wanted your money, anti-science), but the one that stood out to me, was the group of people who described christians as MEAN and UNLOVING. And that was the most shocking thing, cause I could not understand, how someone could uniformely describe christians as unloving. But now that I am on the other side, I can now understand that perception.

      I don’t hate my christian breathren, but I do get frustrated with them from time to time.

      • unkleE says:

        “I don’t hate my christian breathren, but I do get frustrated with them from time to time.”

        Me too! I feel more strongly about them (well, “us” really) than I do about non-believers.

      • Arkenaten says:

        Yes, mean and unloving. I am sure Unklee will remember the bloke Mike Gantt and his rather insensitive and later, scathing comments on one of his blogs about Nate and his deconversion.

  2. Arkenaten says:

    Religion, in all of its inglorious metamorphisms, has never been friendly toward non-believers.
    If you are outside the fold they are going to ‘come after you’, one way or another.
    In this rapidly shrinking global village, religion and its proponents are beginning to realise how untenable their position is fast becoming.
    This is evidenced by at least two examples: the C of E,(Anglican) which is losing ground hand over fist, and at the other end of the spectrum the dramatic rise in Evangelical fundamental churches, especially in the States.
    Whereas the Anglican are trying to adjust and find some sort of relevance, and by all accounts are losing, the Evangelicals and Charismatics are expanding their ‘mission’ and intend to fight light a pitbull with attitude.
    One of the marvelous things about social media, however, is none of this can be done in the metaphorical dark any more, and every move is put under the microscope, so that ultimately, even the likes of William Lane Craig and his ilk will fail in their quest to inculcate and pervert otherwise perfectly ordinary people.

    It is very much like a drop of ink in an otherwise clear pond. The ripples will spread until even supposed liberal-minded religious believers will seem like silly anachronisms.
    Christianity will be the first to fizzle away, and once the Catholic Church finally admits it is all make believe and issues some sort of global apology – and you bet it will, eventually- it will only be a matter of time for the others to follow suit. In fact I believe you will eventually see a huge about face as former believers (especially clergy) from the more formal religions band together to encourage Jews and Muslims to come to terms with the reality that what they believe is nonsense.

    No doubt that Christians who read your blog, Marcus may smile and scoff, but the writing is on the proverbial Wailing Wall.

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